Re: [linux-audio-dev] Other real-time options

Hi,

I think a part of the conversation I had with Con Kolivas may be of
interest here:

<jmspeex> I still don't understand why this [unprivileged real-time]
hasn't gone in the kernel a long time ago.
<con> demand
<con> noone demands it
<con> no distro needs it
<con> no market for it
<con> noone coded it
<con> all of the above
<jmspeex> con: Everyone doing audio demands it, perhaps just no on lkml
<con> jmspeex we talked about this; the developers think they know what
users want
<jmspeex> Just look at how many people are complaining about audio skips
<con> jmspeex where? I see none
<con> what audio skips?
<con> find me a report anywhere that shows a properly configured 2.6
system is skipping audio even with a mainline kernel
<con> the demand for real time is from the professional audio people
which there are but few
<jmspeex> con: Search for "xmms" and "skip", or "jackd" and "xrun"
<con> ordinary desktop users get good enough low latency out of normal
scheduling
<con> jackd xrun != audio skipping on normal desktop usage
<jmspeex> con: In my case, I needed your patch just so I could play and
record at the same time on an 8-chan card.
<con> aah record
<con> that's not normal desktop usage
<con> see what I'm getting at?
<con> you're claiming it is required for ordinary audio playback
<con> it is most definitely not required for ordinary audio playback
<jmspeex> con: There's more people doing serious audio than you may
think.
<con> jmspeex ok now you're at the crux of the problem
<jmspeex> Most people perhaps don't know what to do about it.
<con> the crux of the problem is the potential userbase is not well
known
[...]
<con> a tiny bit of history for you - when the realtime LSM got knocked
back for the professional audio people, I stepped up and defined what
they needed, and offered to create what they needed...
<con> that's when I started coding up the SCHED_ISO work
[...]
<con> jmspeex since lkml is so hopeless as a forum for that sort of
thing, feel free to start an online petition to show how many people
there are. 1 of 2 things will happen - 1. you'll have thousands signing
up, or 2. there are less people doing it than you think

        Jean-Marc

Le vendredi 08 avril 2005 à 16:28 -0400, Lee Revell a écrit :
> On Fri, 2005-04-08 at 16:14 -0400, Jean-Marc Valin wrote:
> > As far as I see it, we'll at least get listened to by Con, Ingo and
> > Andrew Morton. I've had a long discussion with Con recently and from his
> > point of view, the problem is that not enough people ask (loud enough)
> > for such features. For instance, I'm still the first and only user of
> > his real-time patch.
>
> I think many of the kernel developers have fallen into the trap of only
> listening to the distros on the assumption that if enough users want
> something that they'll hear from RedHat or SuSE. Clearly this is
> necessary to some extent, as the distros have to filter out the
> actionable bug reports, etc., and works for 99% of what users want, but
> the other 1% who use a specialized distro that does not have kernel
> hackers on the payroll have a hard time getting heard.
>
> But they will listen if people make enough noise on the mailing list.
>
> Lee
>
>

-- 
Jean-Marc Valin <Jean-Marc.Valin@email-addr-hidden>
Université de Sherbrooke