Re: [linux-audio-dev] Re: linuxaudio.org

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Subject: Re: [linux-audio-dev] Re: linuxaudio.org
From: Tim Orford (tim_AT_orford.org)
Date: Wed Jan 14 2004 - 17:27:03 EET


On Wed, Jan 14, 2004 at 12:10:52PM +0000, Daniel James wrote:
> > Would you mind putting your case to the wider community here?
>
> It's my intention to do that with the launch of the project later
> today.
>
> > Marek has objections which appear to have some weight
>
> Only if you don't know what we're doing. Given that the project isn't
> even underway yet and has only been in preparation for the last
> couple of weeks, it's premature for Marek to attempt to both force
> the direction of the project and prevent the site from being
> launched. He wanted the domain name himself for a different site, but
> he didn't bother to register it.

there is an argument that once the project has launched, it is
too late.

>
> > but
> > i'm sure i'm not the only one who doesnt really know what is
> > going on here.
>
> Hence the need for the launch to be done properly, which takes time of
> course. As I explained to Marek, I'm not going to launch a project
> with zero community support. All I've been doing in the last couple
> of weeks is putting the idea to the LAD members that I know (or know
> by their software), and asking for their support. We can now launch a
> project with 17 members organisations rather than zero members, which
> in my view is now far more likely to succeed. It's not a cabal, and
> we haven't stopped anyone from joining.

without wider community discussion, the accusation - rightly or
wrongly - is that it is exactly that: a cabal. How can we join something
that doesnt exist and that we havnt been told about? Its all a bit
surreal.

So how do i join? You need a european sound engineer perhaps.

>
> > It is very
> > important that representation of linux audio to the outside world
> > is done correctly. It is not an easy thing to do.
>
> You're quite right, especially as there is little financial support
> for advocacy work. I'm launching this on my own time and funding it
> out of my own pocket, but after that it's up to the management board,
> representing the membership, to decide if I need to be replaced as
> Director. But someone has to get the project started.

As you havnt made a case, i couldnt comment on whether the project
is needed. And we are all doing this on our own time...

>
> > corporate involvement is also pretty controversial.
>
> Corporates are already critically involved in Linux audio. Andrew
> Morton is paid for his kernel work through OSDL - check their
> membership list. ALSA is supported financially by SUSE, owned by
> Novell. These firms are as corporate as it gets.

Ok, although i didnt say so, i was referring to the proaudio
industry, which i view as being quite different. I agree that
the work done by companies such as SUSE on system infrastructure
is valuable.

But the last few months has seen a big increase in corporate
stakes in linux. I beleive that the controversies are only just
beginning to be felt. There has always been disagreement over
how much their involvement is a good thing. The main danger for
me is that commercial pressures inevitably produce systems similar
to other existing systems aimed at the lowest common denominator.

>
> What matters to me is that corporate interests don't overrule other
> interests. Linuxaudio.org is mostly composed of libre software
> projects, who get a seat on the management board, just like companies
> - regardless of size. If you check the management boards of
> organisations like OSDL or CE Linux Forum, you'll notice that libre
> software projects don't get any representation there at all.

I'm not sure its a fair comparison.

I'll wait until your announcement. But i'm sorry that you
dont appreciate the danger that you are alienating people here
by doing things behind closed doors. I cant imagine why you chose
not to discuss it openly. Dont forget that community
is what makes linux what it is.

-------------

i just saw the url posted by Fred Gleason.

the aims are stated as:
        The aim of the Linuxaudio.org consortium is to
        promote and enable the use of Linux kernel based systems for
        professional audio use.

Thats ok for a press release, but what does it mean in practice?
Its way too vague. What exactly are you promoting?

Its also a very wide range of companies you have there - too wide?
No offence to these companies, but do i really want Mandrake and
4Front speaking for me?

cheers

-- 
Tim Orford


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