Subject: Re: [linux-audio-dev] Request/Offer: Debian package for Scala
From: Dave Robillard (drobilla_AT_connect.carleton.ca)
Date: Mon Dec 20 2004 - 01:30:41 EET
On Sun, 2004-19-12 at 16:59 -0500, John Check wrote:
> On Sunday 19 December 2004 11:00 am, Dave Robillard wrote:
> > On Sat, 2004-18-12 at 16:44 -0500, John Check wrote:
> > > > The source doesn't matter to YOU.
> > >
> > > Source of the apps, not source code. All of the good things about free
> > > software are not constants that apply in every case or context.
> >
> > Yes they are. Most people may not care in many cases, or other
> > interests may trump freedom, but that's irrelevant.
>
> Selfish
>
> >
> > > It's the fact's Jack, for most people source code is worth bupkis. Just
> > > because we happen to not be most people does not invalidate that.
> >
> > I really couldn't care less.
> >
>
> Selfish. Mind you, I'm selfish too, as are we all, so you don't care, I don't
> care. Sweet! Let's all have a cup of STFU over it then.
Selfish? What the hell are you talking about?
> > my point was made. Your "cause" is not the same as everyone else's, get
> > over it - It's the fact's(sic) Jack
> >
> > If you really don't get it: my cause is a 100% free software music
> > production system (and I don't really care what particular kernel that
> > system runs on for the record). Good, proprietary apps may be best for
> > your cause, but it sure as hell isn't best for mine.
> >
> >
>
> So, what are you calling your reimplementation of Scala then?
.. I don't recall saying I was reimplementing Scala.
> It doesn't matter to anybody but you (editorial sense) what your cause is. I'm
> not judging anybody, I acknowledge it takes all kinds.
>
> I'll try not to sound too patronizing and I hate to do this on list but, my
> recollection is you're a 20 something musician/grad student who's plans are
> X,Y and Z. I don't question your commitment at this point in time, but
> y'know, look at human history. Do you expect to be where you are now in 10
> years? How do you propose to parlay your free software contributions into a
> living? It's a dilemma you'll need to deal with if that's the plan. If yer
> counting on hacking in your spare time... talk to the people who would be
> your peers.
That's what you call not patronizing?
Last I checked your primary interest in Linux Audio was to take all the
technologies and package them in a nice commercial form so you can make
money off other people's work.
Pop quiz: Who's more selfish?
> I'm a 44 year old musician/former audio engineer/computer bottom feeder with
> no day job and no formal education who's likely had more ups and downs than
> you've had hot meals and sees a great opportunity for someone with my
> particular skill set, thanks to the hard work of a lot of talented people.
Congratulations, you're old and unemployed. This obviously makes you
always correct and me a complete idiot I guess?
> I think your apparent lack of concern for what kernel the apps run on
> combined with the insistence on telling me what's best for "my cause" is
> cute, like when a puppy runs headlong into a sliding door, so knock it off.
Please show me /exactly/ where I told you what's best for /your/ cause.
No really. Paste please. Prove you're not just flat-out lying to my
face (which you are).
> Search the list archive for my position paper. Read it. Notice that it
> acknowledges everybody has their own areas of expertise and that
> I state in clear english, a strategy to generate a pool of development money
> that doesn't require any effort from the community. I also state that I do
> not code and intended to act as a filter between users and developers. Logic
> will tell you that is a good state of affairs for people who do code. I
> watched the thread regarding prototyping a PCI card with some interest as
> well. It's an ambitious goal and I'd rather work on bootstrapping that than
> cock around playing holier-than-thou on a list.
>
> We all make our contributions, whatever they may be. One has to be a
> pragmatist in life though. I'd rather see a task being done on Linux
> generating some mind share to feed the machine than tell a client "Linux
> can't do it because author A wrote his own license".
Yeah, you want to package Linux audio systems to sell to people. Not
only that, you wrote a nice little document about how everyone else
should organize to do this job for you as well as possible. That's
nice, but how it contributes to "the community" is beyond me. Sure will
contribute to your wallet if all goes well though, eh?
If you want to be a filter between groups of people, maybe you should
try the following:
- Don't be rude
- Don't be condescending
- Don't lie about what people said in an attempt to attack them
- Don't call people childish names
I sure hope you don't plan to be your own PR man.
-DR-
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