Subject: Re: [linux-audio-dev] protux - another ambitious lad-ish project
From: David Olofson (david_AT_gardena.net)
Date: Fri Feb 09 2001 - 03:07:54 EET
On Wednesday 07 February 2001 15:26, Juhana Sadeharju wrote:
> >http://protux.sourceforge.net/
> >"Protux' goal is to create a definitive solution for audio
> > professionals who use Linux, and need a powerful and practical
> > software for the daily work."
>
> Heh heh! Yet another "GIMP of audio", "SoundForge clone", etc.
> Welcome!
Or; "Here we go again." :-)
But as you say, sooner or later one of these projects ought to result
in something useful.
> I don't intend to sound bad, but this tactics of popping new
> editors once a month is not efficient at all. While I'm sure that
> in the future comes a month when right people starts the project
> and we finally get what is needed, we would get the software faster
> by being co-operative.
Yep. However, there is something in the human nature that makes
cooperation a less appealing alternative emotionally. ("Not invented
here" etc...)
In theory, it would be perfect if all these projects could
concentrate on one or two issues each using some common standard that
allows it all to be integrated on the user level.
But, hey, that standard sounds just like what I've been trying to
construct for quite some time now! ;-)
Ok, most people will probably agree that it's a good idea, but we
still have this problem with people being more interested in leading
something than being a part of something big and less personal. It's
also a matter of user interface integration and of design consistency
in general, even if everything would be built as MAIA and LADSPA
plugins.
Does it really make a good virtual studio environment if the
sequencer transport control, the piano roll editor, the event list,
the audio editor and all other parts are plugins written by different
people, or even as individual projects? (Considering that Free/Open
Source developers are likely to lose lots of motivation if forced
into a too strict set of design guidelines...)
Possibly yes!
I think an important key factor to make this possible is the strict
GUI/DSP separation already employed by LADSPA, and which I'll try to
build on further in MAIA. Using a standardized interface between the
DSP plugin and it's user interface makes it possible to use "third
party" user interfaces for all plugins, significantly reducing the
amount of work that has to be done when implementing something like
the "GIMP of audio", even if the designer would like to reinvent
*all* parts of the user interface.
> (Or, we could together just wait when Paul writes one.)
That actually seems to be rather effective... ;-)
Nothing short of impressive, Paul! :-)
> Yep, everyone wants code immediately and no any designs or plans
> are needed.
Well, except for that MAIA guy, who never does much but design. ;-)
> But just look at the existing software: they look
> exactly like having no designs and plans done. I would like to see
> that we back-off from the traditional "this is for fun", "it's just
> a hobby", etc. attitudes and start working just like they work in
> good, big software companies.
Yep. And it'll be more fun when there finally is running code. Clean
code with a good underlying design is always more fun to hack in the
long run. (I'm forced to hack a great deal on the opposite kind of
code at work... *aaargh*)
> We need a person (or two) who is able to manage the project, keep
> up the complexity and distribute tasks for other volunteers. We
> also need volunteers who are ready for taking the given tasks ---
> we don't need hackers who are only cabable of doing what they like
> to do.
Exactly. How do we get enough people of that kind together without
"motivating" them in similar ways to how companies do it...?
Personally, I'd point people to KDE and other successful projects.
Who wouldn't be pretty proud of an entry in the credits of such a
project?
One should probably reserve a special place for the names of people
who worked according to the "design then implement" plan from the
early stages of the project. Imagine being on the list of names that
show up when the Free/Open Source Cubase VST killer fires up - should
motivate a few audio hackers a bit! :-)
> OK, there are plenty of good people here. With hacker's attitude,
> only a few of them finds any use. With software developer's
> attitude, we would get more people involved.
>
> I'm ready to start when ever you do!
Personally, I really need to do *less* design and *more* hacking for
a while, but I think the design behind the code I'm hacking now
should be rather well thought through by now... ;-)
//David
.- M A I A -------------------------------------------------.
| Multimedia Application Integration Architecture |
| A Free/Open Source Plugin API for Professional Multimedia |
`----------------------> http://www.linuxaudiodev.com/maia -'
.- David Olofson -------------------------------------------.
| Audio Hacker - Open Source Advocate - Singer - Songwriter |
`--------------------------------------> david_AT_linuxdj.com -'
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